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Message started by richie on May 29^th, 2012, 4:07am

Title: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on May 29^th, 2012, 4:07am

For over the last years i´ve been having problems with my chest.
I wrote this earlier. spasms around breastbone, skipped heart beats, pain in chest. rapid heartbeat during a minor exercise, and so on.
I have had numerous check ups and so far so good.

The only thing that is a bit odd is my thyroid THS and T4 serum values.
THS is climbling slowly till now 4.0 (must be in the range 0.4 -4 and sometimes 4.3)
T4 14.2 (must be in 11-25 range).

Reading in thyroid studies, my TSH is rather on the high side of normal so you could speak of a possible slow working thyroid.

My doc isnt concerned and he dont want to sent me to a specialist.
Is there a correlation with my symptoms? and what should I do?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 1^st, 2012, 8:43am

I´m having a strange new symptom. My hands and feet have a tingling feeling and sometimes prickles/needle pins and when taking a warm bad, my hands burn like needle and pins feeling and lot of itchy feeling

More and more worried

Title: Re: please help.
Post by richie on Jun 5^th, 2012, 8:04am

its getting more and more complicated.
Last sunday I experienced a huge attack of hyperventilation /chronic hyperventilation.. My father who visited didnt trust it and rushed me to the hospital. I told him not too worry cause this must be my CHV I told him. Like I said he didnt trust it..I was trembling and shaking, had pain in my feet and arms ..tingling an prickling.. the feelings I had for days like I wrote you guys.. In the hospital they indeed saw Chronic hypervantilation levels of bloodgass and a 100% saturation of oxygen ..
What they didnt understand was my prickles and tingling and painfull feet (frontpart) and toes and the weird prickling in my hands.. it could be due to the hyperventilation but when I told them i had this for days and increasing over days they dindt know for sure..

they thought it could be polyneuropathy ... so now I panicked..
how do I know the difference between needles and pins prickles and tingling cold feelings in my toes and feet and my hands and wrists and bit underarm and leg below knee.. and much cold and painful toes and fingers.. as a symptom of CHV chronic hyperventilation or a polyneuropathy due to an illness?

the hospital checked some reflexes and if I had feeling in my toes..and that was ok..but they say that dindt say everything but cause it was an emergy room..it was not acute..so it was ok for now..

please help

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 6^th, 2012, 4:13am

another update

after a night of pain in my toes and fingers and lower legs a feeling of prickling in my hands and the feeling of many parts of my whole body feel like they are full of the sensation of tiger balm on your skin, some palpitations due to hyperventilation chronic and anxiety feelings due to the sensations in my toes fingers,l body annd so on I went to the doctor.
I had a female doc instead of my own doctor and she first didnt know what to do. she was puzzled reflexes again turned out ok, feeling in my hands and feet ok.. the cold sensation she couldnt explain.. the pain in my fingers and toes could be the nerves itching..

but due to what. maybe the CHV but again not really sure.
I asked her if this could be polyneuropathy due to illness.. but she couldnt say for now..

I hope RLR who also has a history in neurological disorders would like to help me here, cause the pain in my toes and feet and fingers and hands is like a burning cold sensation. which now travels to my body sometimes.. circulation was ok in my feet and hands and reflexes and feelings normal for now.

is this all anxiety and CHV or is this not related and neuropathical or reuma like
please help

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 7^th, 2012, 8:22am

update : although I had palpitations all night and I couldnt walk easily due the needles and pins and painfull tingling in my feet/toe area I got out of my comfortzone (home and bed) and went to a city nearby where me and my wife have walked for hours. This went quite well as longer as I walked. the pain subsided somewhat, and the prickling too.
the tingling in my hands remain.

I hope that the fact I could now walk for hours while walking the last days wasnt easy due to the havy prickling and sensations in my toes and feet is a good sign.

anyone?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 8^th, 2012, 8:31am

today its all very bad again
I have skin burning feeling ( like tiger balm again) all over my legs and arms and body..
all day long. really really scared now whats wrong

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 11^th, 2012, 8:25am

still the same all day and night..

unfortunately no response or no recognition..

very worried never had this constant skin burning over my body for a week now

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by George88 on Jun 11^th, 2012, 9:41am

I wonder, how are your symptoms upon waking? I ask not because I'm able to advise you either way, but I used to get tingling sensations in my hands and sometimes feet, and I realised that I never had any symptoms upon waking, probably due to be not being awake and able to hyperventilate in my sleep. I used to notice that the symptoms would worsen throughout the course of the day and then be gone when I awoke.

Perhaps if you notice this pattern also, or something similar, it may be a sign that you are indeed just hyperventilating? Not that I'm offering you advice or attempting a diagnosis by any means; just my opinion.

If three doctors have examined you and sent you away, perhaps your problems are not urgent? I sympathise somewhat but I've never experienced what you're describing.

George.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 11^th, 2012, 11:30pm

thx for responding.
I will try to investigate if just when i wake up i experience less symptoms.
About the skin burning sensation. This is new for me, I do have it for over a week now . This started after a week of tingling and prickling in my hands and feet and a attack of (chronic) hyperventilation /anxiety attack, i quess setted of due to these sensations i felt for days.
the burning skin i do feel at night to. its like i cant have anything colder on my skin than my skin temperature. Also when i rub my skin it burns.
its in my opinion my nerves firing so now i'm afraid its a polyneuropathy which is often seen in illnesses. I was hoping RLR would give some advice cause i'm in a loop here.
why is all this only anxiety in me and why is this in other people 7 out of 10 times due to an illness or brainproblem

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 13^th, 2012, 6:47am

symptoms of skin burning still there 24/7
also at night also in the morning.
I dont think anyone recognize this or knows what this is.
I notice even my doc is confused. Because I have CHV and anxiety label he thinks anxiety. But if you google you learn that if I had MS it would be due to MS. Fybromyalgia. it would be due to that. Neuropathy problems..it would be beacuse of that. and so on.if you catch my drift.. I start to think it can be anything

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by George88 on Jun 13^th, 2012, 10:30am

Hello Richie,

I too have noticed that when I've spoken to my GP and various other doctors about concerns I've had in the past, they have each seen my history of anxiety and seemingly added another symptom to the list.

Having said that, I don't know the process by which they reached their conclusions and it may be that as a patient naive to the majority of the medical world, I am simply drawing conclusions that are false. I will say that I'm pretty sure since anxiety is a nervous disorder, that I believe there is a practically unending number of symptoms that may occur due to the fact that everything is under master control of the brain and nervous system, though this is simply my opinion and may not be true.

I'm sorry but I am in no position to give you an opinion on your problems. I've never experienced what you describe and I've never seen or heard of anyone else experiencing it.

In your first post you said that your THS is on the high side of normal and climbing. Didn't your doctor try and explain why and what the consequences of this are? Is it a case of "normal is normal", meaning high-normal or low-normal are indifferent. Surely a rising level means something? I don't know.

Go back to your doctor and push them for answers. You have a right to know everything you want to know and don't allow them to simply shrug off your concerns. Make them explain to you why they're not concerned about your rising levels and tell you why it is of no consequence.

I'm being ignorant, but if it doesn't even matter that your levels are rising or are high, like your doctor has said, what's the point in taking the test in the first place? If it doesn't come with an explanation then it's meaningless. Again, I know nothing of which I speak here so take anything I say with skepticism.

Perhaps it could be a relationship with another entity in the body, for example white cell count rises rapidly and dramatically in the presence of infection, then lowers to normal once the pathogen has been eradicated. Likewise, perhaps the levels you're concerned with also rise and fall with certain conditions? Either way, you need to know.

Anyway, I'll stop trying to sound like I know what I'm talking about and urge you to question your doctor a little deeper until you're satisfied with the advice you're given.

George.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 14^th, 2012, 7:14am

thx for answering again

I've had some results of my bloodtests.
ANA negative so thats good
All my other bloodtest of red and whtecells and so on were ok/fine.

my B12 was low. 195 which is very low but still just in the range called normal. 150 is lowest 700 highest what in my country is called normal.
So its just ok. and low B12 levels CAN cause a lot of my symptoms
my doc thinks 195 is not too low so not a problem.

the burning sensation still unknown.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by RLR on Jun 17^th, 2012, 6:53pm

"why is all this only anxiety in me and why is this in other people 7 out of 10 times due to an illness or brain problem?"

Where did you establish such a statistic? You are making interpretations of your clinical lab features and physical symptoms and casting them as pathological in the absence of the requisite clinical training to do so. I'm constrained to point out that the act of doing so doesn't make your conclusions accurate and are only depicted in your postings to confirm your own suspicions or conclusions. Practicing medicine is well beyond merely seeking out literature on the internet and drawing conclusions.

The more you worry that something is wrong, the greater the symptoms become and the more you worry. The problem here is not what is actually wrong with you, but what you believe is wrong with you. It's very critical to realize here that you're seeking my interpretation based upon information you are providing me as though it somehow would validate evaluation by internet. You do see the practical impossibility of doing so, correct?

You are regularly presenting me with lab data and physical symptom characteristics for me to evaluate based upon your belief that something physical is wrong with you and regardless of my response, you seek to challenge it by providing other data and symptoms as though trying to prove to me that something other than what I'm suggesting is present. Not that it's necessary, but I'd remind you that although I'm now 93 years of age, I practiced medicine for more than 40 years. Do you really suggest that I'm so aloof as to not recognize what the most probable cause for your symptoms are and that they do not fit the characteristic patterns for neurological disease which I have observed and treated in hundreds of instances?

In what capacity am I serving here, Ritchie? I'm constrained to point out that I have little time to discuss differential diagnosis with a layperson who refuses to accept the opinions of the collective medical community but yet you continue to make inquiry? If we're inaccurate or not understanding the true nature of your difficulty, of what value is it to repeatedly seek out the very same source time and again?

I've collectively read every single one of your open postings and the multiple private messages you've addressed to me regarding your symptoms. I've repeatedly stated my professional opinion regarding the symptom patterns, as well as my conclusions. If you don't trust those conclusions or you don't feel that my opinions are qualified, then providing me with additional data and argument is not going to produce a different outcome. I'm the physician here, not you.

If you believe that you have a physical illness, then you need to direct your concerns to your primary care physician or specialist for evaluation and potential treatment. I've repeatedly shared my opinions with you, apparently to no benefit and I'll note here that I simply haven't the time to try and unweave the constant attempts being made to interpret your lab data as pathological in some way and a causal factor to your health problems.

I wish you the best in working with your doctors to determine how best to help you restore your physical health, but we've reached a point in the forum discussion here where the capacity of this forum to assist you has been exceeded.

Best regards,

Rutheford Rane, MD (ret.)

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 18^th, 2012, 6:54am

Dear RLR

I understand your response.
I´m not questioning anyone´s knowledge. I´m just ventilating whats going on in my body. I recognize the same pattern with most of the posters here. they all, like me , experience symptoms. When it remains just those symptoms (which are often evaluated and looked at by doctors and als addressed here) people tend to get by. and start to believe in anxiety, vagus, and so on. But as soon as new or other symptoms occur they are back questioning things and address the new symptoms.
In my case...I try to be so complete possible in what I experience as new and what is done lately testing (bloodtests and so on)
the last months I got more and more symptoms. the last thing is constant skin burning sensation over my whole body and slight painfull feet (toes) and fingers but foremost skin burning without rash

Then i present in this forum some of the blood data I got and ask for a possible explanation or reassurance. Again I try to do this with so much possible info for you

I guess we all do that here..
Reading your answer (mostly between the lines) I fully understand where you are coming from, but Its like I said. IF it remained with all previous symptoms which also are still there 24/7 then its more easy to start to understand it could be anxiety. but if you get symptom over symptom upon it, then its not entirely illogical to address this as a possibility something could be causing this besides ANXIETY

I know skin burning CAN be a symptom DURING an anxiety attack or panic attack. but 24/7 ??? with no anxiety signals otherwise internally?

then I go back to my tsh and then its allmost a bit to high 4.0 ..is the end of the normal range on the higher side. so a slight tendency of a slow working thyroid. B12 low normal and my CHV.
What I want to know is IF this could cause my symptoms? including the skin burning?

I know I have my own doc like we all do here..but we come here for more reassurance cause we feel like crap and dont understand why??
my doc is puzzled but due to all good reflexes and no loss of strength he doesnt think it serious, but he doesnt know either whats causing all this. In his words he says' in 80 % of all cases the symptoms people come in with are all gone in a few w eeks and often we didnt know why one had it in the first place.'

in my case..he simply doesnt know but he dont think its an illness so far.
so his best quess is anxiety.but he doesnt know for sure

What I ask is. Is skin burning accompanied with my others symptoms and bloodlab still anxiety and why is that the logical explanation?

thats all

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 24^th, 2012, 8:31am

symptoms still there. With a negative ANA bloodtest what do I rule out?
red and whitecell distribution ok. Always a high HB, high hematocriet, high erytrocytes. (high as in ..almost top of the range normal)

If this is all anxiety why is this burning skin all over and prickling arms and feet 24/7 there? Or is it therefore more likely anxiety than anything neuropathical ? the spasms and palpitations are gone for a week now. That has made me wonder even more. Why do the spasms suddenly are less now I have these skin sensations 24/7?

I really like more explanation. cause i really hope its due to anxiety but My body does weird things and shouldnt I have more palpitations when so highly stressed that my skin burns and my nerves keep firing??

Allthough I without a doubt have the symptoms seen in neurophatical problems , how do I know this is due to anxiety ?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 26^th, 2012, 9:58am

In the 'here is a question for all of you' thread I added some things why i really wish people could address if my burning skin all over my body..mostly legs but everywhere 24/7 for three weeks is due anxiety and whyit isnt neuropathical. small fiber neuropathy or something like that. whats the difference?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by George88 on Jun 27^th, 2012, 4:51am

736862696864010 wrote:

Richie,

No one here is going to be able to address that concern of yours. We're not medical professionals or doctors, and Dr. Rane has already given you his opinions. Perhaps you should seek a referral to a specialist?

I certainly have no advice for you, I don't think anyone else is going to either. You must take this up with your doctors in person.

George.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 27^th, 2012, 7:07am

sorry I understand your comment but..

then nobody could ask a question anymore. Cause besides RLR no one is a doctor. Everyone here asks questions they could address to their own specialist. Its because of the lack of explanation or understanding whats wrong people ask questions here.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by George88 on Jun 27^th, 2012, 2:45pm

5C474D46474B2E0 wrote:

What I mean to say is that you're asking something very specific about your body. I doubt anybody here has the required qualifications, training and experience to even surmise at what is causing the non-stop burning all over your skin. Dr. Rane is the only medical professional around here and the rest of us found the forum the same way you probably did, from some other forum or word of mouth because we were searching the Internet for diseases that we thought we had.

Anyway, I'm not trying to encourage you to stop posting. This is a free and open board, I'm just saying that Dr. Rane has given you his opinion that there are no neurological diseases that display symptoms the way yours present, and I would suppose it is reasonable to assume that a condition such as yours has at least something to do with your neurological system. I'm basing that opinion soley on what I've read on this forum and medical web sites (such as Patient.co.uk), it seems common that symptoms like itching, burning and tingling present themselves in anxiety.

A few days ago I noticed after a day of being moderately nervous about something new that I was doing (unrelated to anxiety), both my hands were tingling when I got home in the evening and continued to tingle for the rest of that day. I've had this before to the point where I would be nearing a panic attack just because of the tingling, but now I just don't care. I understood that I had a nervous day and my symptoms were probably caused by that, and I forgot about it. When I woke up it was gone and I didn't think about it again.

Richie, the way you talk about your constant burning is as if you feel like you're on fire or something. I mean, the impression I've had from your postings is that you have a severe, unrelenting painful and traumatic burning all over your body. Am I correct or just misunderstanding you?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jun 27^th, 2012, 11:43pm

its like a sunburn. the amount of pain is subjective. I cant say how much, but it feels like a sunburn.

meanwhile I had an episode of pressure and squeezing just under my breastbone. lots of burping. and little squeezes. my food when swallow goes down, but seem to have its impact on that same place.also when i lay on my side these pressure increases there. I dont think its heartrelated but more stomach or reflux, or even costochondritis tietze. Anyway. had better days to put it mildly

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 1^st, 2012, 1:30pm

palpitations and spasms are back. is it because I worry from my burning skin? could very well be..

the thing that frustrates me the most is that I dont know if this burning skin is a neuropathy or not? My doc doesn't think that my burning skin on various parts of my body (feet, arms, legs, parts of my shoulders and belly/chest..and scalp.) is a neuropathy cause I got that burning feeling over my whole body within a week. sometimes it has a tiger balm icy hot burn sensation.
my doc sys a neuropathy doenst go that fast..
cloths on my legs or some parts of my skin irritates.. like a cold sunburn. when I rub my skin I can produce the same burning. no rash. some aching around joints (knee, wrists)
too much heat of the sun is difficult to bare for my skin. cold wind on my skin doesnt feel ok.
when i stretch my wrist and ankles/feet than i feel a painful prickling stretch.in wrists and ankle feet. my feet are sensitive when i walk on rough carpets. the front and toes are at least. walking itself ok, no reflex problems. no numbness. feels like enough power strength.

but if this is a neuropathy ( which could be from an underlying illness or ideopatic) than it could be serious cause the longer this exists the chance of damage to my nerves gets bigger. let alone if there is an illness underneath causing it remains unnoticed.

Its agonizing that as a patient you just want to know if its sounds like a neuropathy or IS a neuropathy . and if it is whats causing it? or if it doesnt is a neuropathy or something serious causing this'what causes this?

and all you hear is. I dont think so. doc doesnt think its neurological, but he doesnt know why I have this..or he or people relate it to anxiety..cause I have anxiety issues in the past. but a real explanation is left out. My doc doesnt see any warranty in sending me to a specialist cause he thinks its nothing serious allthough he cant give me an explanation??

strange and it surely is not giving any peace of mind.

the internet is full of skin burning. You see it in MS, fibromyalgie, Lupus , cancers, sarcoidose, vascular problems..thyroid and diabetes and so on. So what is it???????? it sure isnt normal

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 2^nd, 2012, 10:13am

I would really ask a specialist if that was possible . But in my country you cant go the hospital or specialist on your own.. you have to get sent by your own doctor! my doc doesnt know about skin burning. the only thing he stated that he dont think its neuropathy due to the speed it arose in my body..and MS he thinks is way to early to think of..

but whats causing it he doesnt know.. maybe due to your stress anxiety he said.. but i dont know..

So I really hope that RLR can understand why I , and I know its a lot too ask again, asked for more explanation what to do in this..
and if its really plausible to assume nothing neuropatic small fiber or some illness like MS or else is underlying my symptoms of burning skin over my body. I know reading on the internet is dead wrong.. but like I said..Skin burning is seen in a lot of disorders.. how do I know mine is anxiety or stress?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 11^th, 2012, 11:08am

still all day long burning skin. most legs and torso. sometimes my inner thighs shoulders. around wrists..arms..even my scalp
I have sore feet. also in whole a sensitive skin. if i rub or scratch my skin it burns . my legs feel heavy and a bit painful

I´ve asked my psycholgist too what she thinks. She doesnt know. My doctor keeps persisting because my reflexes and strength are ok, its not neurological. and thinks its because I´m over sensitive as a person due to possible anxiety..

but he doenst know for sure.. because its so persistant and nothing else comes up, no weakness..no reflex problems

I really need more explanation.
I´ve given all my labs and data cause I wanted to be thorough.
I notice that due to these sensations my palps and mostly the pain on my chest is back

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 17^th, 2012, 11:40am

ok its now 5 weeks non stop burning skin like the sunburn, and burning feet toes. last weeks heavy a bit painful legs. Nobody , my doc, ER doc , substitute doc, they all dont know why. anxiety could be, but ER doc thought that 5 weeks non stop this symptoms is strange.
He never heared of burning skin in anxiety. 5 weeks top anxiety or anxiety attack for 5 weeks was impossible in his mind. I didnt look and present me like an anxiety person in his eyes. not in the matter that could cause this prolonge and weird sensations in his eyes. or present this way only due to anxiety.
reflexes were good, strength also. he did not know if its was neuropathy cause I was in the ET for my chest pain there, which probably in the end was a heavy attack of tietze. chest wall pain.
blood was good he said. also liver and kidney tested, no diabetic problem.

my own doc doesnt seem to think I need a neurologic consult or mri
but its 5 weeks now. Isnt this bad for my nerves if it is neuropathic? the longer it lasts it could damage the nerves i understood.

So please I ask again for more info on my burning skin symptom and burning feet toes. when my toes feet stand on a cable telephone UTP on the ground it burns. rough underground it burns. squeeze my toes with my hands and nothing out of the ordinary happens.. 25/7 burning skin legs ...arms , torso a bit less, scalp...cant stand clothes that easy..its not painful but irritating..painful fingertips while typing. not heavy pain.. how do I know its a neuropathy or not? Is this Anxiety or CHV?
If I cant get the answer from my doc and the ER doc is only for acute problems, I never get an explanation whats causing this..
its a crazy situation.

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 18^th, 2012, 7:18am

I will try this one more time and than I understand i´m on my own with this. When someone is having difficult symptoms which cant be explained that well and as that person is still having permanent persistent symptoms and is worried and keeps asking for more information, than you are seen as a hypochondriac I quess

I think my worry for Small fiber neuropathy is a genuine and fair one.
skin burning like sunburn. feet toes, arms, and legs. scalp, some torso. Also i understand that heart palpitations and gastro symptoms are seen in people with Small fiber neuropathy.

But because i´m the one asking this to exclude it as a diagnosis I get the feeling my doc and other doc dont do this , cause they dont like it when a patient draws own possible possibilities.

Why I dont know.. I just want help.

i understand that reflexes and strength are ok..with people having Small fiber neuropathy. They are also ok on me. My doc said , so this is no neuropathy and you feel my touch and so on.. (but in small fiber neuropathy its not about reflexes , strength and so..)

So how do I know and how can i know the difference between my skin burning and problems feet, leg , arms and so on. /also gastro and heart palps are there which are seen in SFN /
and actual small fiber neuropathy?

why are mine symptoms "nothing serious"?

I desperately hope RLR will help me with this one, otherwise I really dont know anymore what to do. :-/

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by RLR on Jul 23^rd, 2012, 5:06pm

True neurological disease is heralded by the company that certain symptoms keep among others. You do not demonstrate the characteristic patterns of such diseases, but merely have selected to read about and collect certain features of these diseases for which you have elected to establish potential associations.

As I've stated previously, you're not a physician Ritchie and the ability to practice accurate diagnostic skills is absolutely not attainable to any degree whatsoever by collecting and assimilating medical information from the internet of all places. You are relying upon a faulty premise that you actually believe has some degree of accuracy and confidence.

The features you describe are readily established as part of the characteristic somatoform associated with specific levels of anxiety that are capable of stimulating the nervous system to the extent that it produces physiological manifestations. You are neither alone nor unique in such an experience.

True neurological disease is also strictly progressive, with the exception of several variants which demonstrate relapsing/remitting features and I will be forthright here in just as quickly telling you that such diseases are not present in your instance as well.

Having lab values that extend into the upper limits of normal only demonstrates normal and is not suggestive of some type of underlying cause. You seem determined to possess a disease, despite the fact that all of your posted data is entirely within the range of normality.

Your most confrontational question is how can it be possible for you to be experiencing all of these "symptoms" merely by the presence of anxiety. It's a medical fact that has been demonstrated in patient populations spanning the globe and dating far back into history.

You keep asking why and I keep providing you with the requisite information and yet it never suffices. I can't teach you clinical medicine and I can't produce variations from the truth concerning your questions and concerns. You're suffering from intense anxiety of a nature that is producing physiological manifestations that you are misinterpreting as signs and symptoms of actual disease.

There is no other information I can offer you. If you find yourself still incapable of interpreting my response, then I must regrettably suggest that you seek out a forum where the interaction is more consistent with your personal notions of what ails you.

Best regards,

Rutheford Rane, MD (ret.)

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Jul 24^th, 2012, 7:24am

first of all. I´m very grateful that you answered my thread. Mainly due to language differences and difficulty I will try to repeat what you wrote.
I will end with questions i quess because due to the same language difficulties I want to be thorough !!
As a said, my doctor also thinks that my nerves are firing due to my anxiety or maybe chronic hyperventilation. He wont sent me to a neurologist. and in my country you NEED a referral otherwise you cant go to a specialist.
reading your answer you seem to agree that my nerves are acting up so heavily that my whole skin but mainly my legs feet ,and arms but are burning like a sunburn for 6 weeks 24 hours a day now. I have the same feelings on my scalp , torso and so on.. but its a bit more varying.

I understand that 6 weeks of constant and persistant burning sensations and painful places on the skin /mostly wrists and feet and outside lower leg, and real trouble handling clothes on my skin..or any rubbing.. is consistent with ANXIETY and not progressive neuropathy like small fiber?

Is it normal that this takes so long and how long can this remain, or how do I get this senstation to stop. Is there something I can do?

Is it just like my chest pain and costochondritis like the pain on my sternum another symptom of the same anxiety ?

I work with my psychologist and she thinks my anxiety is far less. I was under the assumption that possible symptoms would lessen also, but in fact it seems vice versa.
Is this normal in anxiety disorders?

Its great having anxiety .. :P bizarre what it does to a body.

many thx !!

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by RLR on Aug 1^st, 2012, 6:01pm

I noticed that you responded to a thread regarding symptoms similar to yours and in your response you note that you have been taking omeprazole for years.

Please indicate how many years, whether you have been taking it pretty much daily and whether you have had your B12 levels checked by a clinical lab, how long ago and what the result was of the test.

Significant B12 deficiency can occur in persons on long-term PPI therapy such as omeprazole. This occurs because stomach acid contains something called intrinsic factor which is necessary to absorb B12. If you take a proton pump inhibitor over extended periods, it can reduce stomach acid to the extent that insufficient intrinsic factor is available and consequently, a B12 deficiency often results.

A clinical deficiency in B12 is any level below 200, or any level near 200 during which B12 deficiency symptoms are present. More importantly, and very critical, is that if a true B12 deficiency is found then under no circumstances should folate supplementation be used to assist in restoring proper B12 levels due to clinical reports of irreversible neurological sequelae that may result. B12 deficiencies of the nature induced by extended PPI use should strictly be corrected by B12 injections at a rate of one per week, with a follow-up lab test in 2 months to determine whether proper levels are restored.

A significant B12 deficiency may indeed account for a portion of your symptoms related to your skin paresthesias and can even affect thyroid function.

Best regards,

Rutheford Rane, MD (ret.)

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Aug 1^st, 2012, 10:32pm

Dear Dr Rane

thx for responding.
I wrote earlier that my B12 was low . 195 . this is meassured earlier this year. some years before that I had 235
I´m on and off Losec first and then omeprazole for more than 15 years now. always 20mg a day if using it. In the beginning I used it 3 years in a row. than a couple of years i stopped cause it didnt seem to work enough. For the last years its no and off. sometimes when I have the feeling my stomach and acid reflux is there. I take omeprazole for a while. mostly weeks and than try to stop for a while. But on and off for more than 15 years I guess.
I´ve read the same problems that can occur from taking omeprazole for a long time, but my primairy physcisian (my doc) doesnt think 195 has any clincial meaning. In my country the values that are considered normal are 150-750 so he says. well within range your 195
also my tsh is at the high level of normal 4,0 levels normal here 0.4-4,0/4,3 so again normal and no indication of anything my doc says. t4 was ok 14,2 (must be between 11-23)
my doc doesnt believe in B12 hype he said. and due to the fact that my HB is always been well around 10 (8-11) hematocrite 47 which is high normal and erytrocytes always upper level of high he says perfectly fine

I have reflux problems and like many other a hiatus hernia from my diaphragm. already diagnozed when I was 23-24 , now going 40 years old.

I'm taking pure and only B12 vitamins. in my country folium acid isnt the same as B12 but something else related to B12. Am I correct?

I quess my chestpain and possible vagus induced palps and spasms below chest can sometimes be related?

If my doc still wont try to fix this if you think that it should. What can I do and is this dangerous whatsoever?

slight add on. today after 2 or 3 months. some fast spasms like sensations under brestbone , slightly to the right..which gave pain to jaws and offcourse the position it occured. The spasms are always accompanied as earlier months ago with skipped beats at the moment of the painful spasms. its like they are at the same time.
Is it correct this isnt from my heart and benign?

my tsh was 4,0 0.4-4.0 is the normal range in my country
t4 was 14.2 11-23 is the normal range

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Aug 6^th, 2012, 6:20am

For a couple of weeks I keep having a lot of pain on my chest. it is concentrated on my breastbone centre and from there it goes to my left shoulder arm , and some days to the right arm and shoulder. and shoulderblades on my back. When just standing up tall or walking it increases the feeling
Taking into consideration it cant be angina pectoris, or my heart or a malignant proces. What can I do to get this pain of my chest and how can I handle this pain which increases when standing straight up or walk?
Its very painful and therefore I keep falling back into sitting and laying down. I dont feel like exercise or walking or doing something at home.
Is this the costochondritis or chest wall syndrome acting up combined with anxiety for the symptoms? How to break this cycle?

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Aug 14^th, 2012, 6:57am

hi RLR , I hope you can get back on your question about my B12 which I answered some weeks ago.

furthermore I keep having pain on my chest..a bit right of my breastbone. and the last days I feel dizzy, and sometimes it feels like I going to pass out. I become a bit sweaty than. this will take some seconds or minutes ( it comes back) and than slowly disappears. when is dizzyness heartrelated or serious? and when its benign. ?
I dont feel much weakness. the world is not spinning before my eyes. its a glow thing ..something comes over me. lot of belching sometimes

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by RLR on Aug 15^th, 2012, 4:03pm

With respect to the B12, whether it's considered to be "hype" is something I contest because there would otherwise be no need for B12 monitoring, as well as patients historically demonstrating a range of symptoms of B12 deficiency that are well-documented. I also don't care to bandy the topic about and have shared my opinion. Whether you and your physician choose to treat it is entirely up to you.

Your postings tend to lean toward seeking diagnosis of various aches and pains and I'm constrained to point out that I'm unable to actually pinpoint what the cause may be via the internet. I can tell you that your symptoms appear remarkably benign and in patients with similar complaints, the cause is most always musculoskeletal in origin.

There is also the prospect that the sternal pain could be GERD-related and this sort of pain tends to penetrate through to the back and can also be aggravated when standing or walking in some instances. By contrast, I see absolutely nothing of your symptoms to even remotely suggest that it's heart-related in any manner.

Dizziness is also a very common symptom that can be associated with GI difficulties, most particularly constipation or excessive gas production, which can result in an odd sensorium accompanied by diaphoresis or sweating. Treatment of GI symptoms typically corresponds with a reduction in dizziness and other problems of a similar nature that concern patients. The dizziness and sweating would not be consistent with anything cardiovascular in my opinion.

Again, all of your symptoms are well within the corridor of being anxiety-related and although you seem to persist in steering your apprehension into the arena of serious disease, I simply do not see any clinical basis whatsoever for your rationale in that regard.

Best regards,

Rutheford Rane, MD (ret.)

Title: Re: Thyroid tsh 4.0 ,spasms, skipped heartbeat,pain
Post by richie on Aug 15^th, 2012, 11:56pm

RLR

about the B12 ..My doc thinks its a hype. not me.
He just wont take it serious.
is 195 a deficit?
Is that something , that value that can be dangerous in the long run?
What should I do ..are melttablets an option or is that not the way to handle this? Is injections the only way?

What can I do about this if my own doc wont help me with this?
In my country you need a doctor consensus/referral